Business of Esports - 247. Overwatch 2 Loot Boxes, Ted Cruz & Asmongold vs Microtransactions, Team Liquid Honda, Netflix Games Numbers, Razer Crypto Payments, Oculus Quest 2 Gaming Chair

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From the keyboard to the boardroom, this is the

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business of esports.

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The worlds of gaming and esports are evolving every day faster

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than ever before. With YouTube's living data, you can probe into

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the real thoughts and behaviors of esports fans and gamers

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worldwide. If you're a team, a brand, an agency or a rights

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holder, you should be talking with YouGov. They're partners

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with the biggest names in esports. And the biggest brands

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all around the world, driving compelling results every single

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day, check out youtube.com/bo E and schedule a call with YouGov.

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Today, from the keyboard to the boardroom. This is the business

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of esports weekly news show slash post podcast live stream.

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I am Paul the profit that will lead me I'm joined today by my

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friends and CO hosts the Honorable Judge Jimmy burrata

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Lindsey, the boss, boss, Jeff, the juice Cohen, for those of

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you who are new here, welcome. What we do is we cover the most

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pressing, gaming and esports topics and news of the week but

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we look at all of it through a business and C suite lens. And

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best of all, we get to do it live with you guys. You get to

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get in our faces challenge us ask questions. All of the above.

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We encourage it, it's a safe place. It's a new time, by the

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way. So we're trying out a new time here. It's 230. Eastern

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11:30am. Pacific time.

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It's 1034. Gulf Standard Time. So we're trying to reach more

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time zones. I know there were people in Australia before who

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couldn't listen to the show live. Hopefully, now you can. So

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if you love this time, if you hate this time, please let us

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know. We're just testing it out. I'm not saying this is gonna be

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permanent. But we want to see how it works out. How many of

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you guys show up? Mad says new time saying great people. That's

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Matt. You summarized it. Extremely well. New time. Same

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great people. Is everyone doing today? Let's see how you doing?

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I am so excited for this new time, man. I feel like I'm so

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much more awake. This is gonna be good. You like this? Oh,

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love. I'm not at my best at it. Yeah.

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I'm interested. Chat is I think people might be more likely to

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say, Yeah, I want it. I feel like it's like, it's like doing

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a webinar, right. So for people who are at work or whatever,

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this is a great opportunity to like, kick back for an hour get

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some, you know, gaming and esports knowledge and banter

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and, and then go back to your work day. I think I think that's

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how that's how I'm looking at Adam says I highly approve of

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this time, Adam. Thank you. Appreciate you being here as

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always. And so I'm glad we want feedback. We want to know if you

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guys hate the time, love the time. You have to let us know.

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Because we're going to make a decision in the next few weeks.

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We're you know, do we keep trying this? Do we move it back

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to the original time. We want to make sure we're doing what you

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guys want and what's best for you guys. So Adam says this is

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new. Adam it is new, but again wouldn't be the live stream

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without Ademar and Adam D I remember now I have to specify

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and so appreciate both of you guys being here.

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Guys, I just want to tease before I get into sorry I had a

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bit of a brain fart there. I want to tease the podcast this

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week. incredible guest on the podcast we had the very famous

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Knut and for those who don't know Knut he's a Twitch streamer

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incredibly popular Twitch streamer. One of the big ones

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one of the bigger IRL Twitch streamers in other words he you

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know puts a camera on his back in a backpack and walks around

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and films basically his entire life. He's also a bodybuilder

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like a world class bodybuilder.

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And very, very fascinating guy talked a lot about streaming the

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difficulties the upside, you know the secrets to success,

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what he thinks of the different platforms a lot of great

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conversation all around streaming and entertainment and

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his success there so definitely definitely don't miss that. It's

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a great it's a really great episode. I mean I'm a bit biased

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but it's a really great episode so

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definitely look forward to that.

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Adam says I'd suggest if you can get the podcast guest to join in

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an after show. Then do an after show but definitely do this time

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always. Adam are that is such a good idea. And you know

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We did that last week with Chris. Chris Oh coins and Greg

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and it worked really well like Chris was so great on the live

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stream I don't know if you were if you've managed to catch most

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of it but

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you really thought we were gonna I thought we're gonna kick

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Lindsay out for good I thought she

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had a chance out of this is just got listening just got done

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listening to last week's episode with Chris It was great. Yeah

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Chris was fantastic.

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And you know that I think it's a great idea to maybe try and

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bring the guests as much as possible on the live stream

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after the fact I definitely think we should do that. So

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love, love, love love the idea and we are definitely going to

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try that.

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Adam R says if Lindsey leaves all riot Don't tempt me

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if Lindsay leaves I would riot to so I mean

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no one's no one's replacing Lindsay There you go.

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All right, guys, let's, let's jump into some news. We have

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lots of news to get to this week.

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I want to start with

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Overwatch to Overwatch to in the news and, and I think it was

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interesting news. I don't know how much of a discussion to how

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deep we're gonna get into this. But the headline at least caught

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my attention here and the headline is

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Overwatch to will get rid of loot boxes. As the game

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transitions to a free to play seasonal content model, the

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controversial loot award system will be replaced with an in game

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shop. So in Overwatch two, it says loot boxes are no more

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it's going to be free to play. And there will be an in game

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shop where you can buy cosmetics and things like that. So no loot

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boxes like they had in Overwatch one now.

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It says there will be a Battle Pass, the developers declined to

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go into detail about what the battle paths were full feature

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of there will be a Battle Pass and an end game shop.

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And they talk a little bit about in the article about sort of the

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background of the backlash against Diablo immortal and how

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that has been structured the way that the pay to win structure

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there. I'm curious what you guys think of Overwatch to coming out

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and saying we're not going to do loot boxes because loot boxes

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were the primary, if not basically the only form of

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monetization in Overwatch one, the so this is a pretty dramatic

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shift. I'm curious what you guys think of the shift and what you

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think drove the shift?

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Well, if you're Overwatch, I think monetization is a

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secondary concern for you right now. Right? Your primary concern

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is Has anyone gonna even play this game, because it's been so

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long, it's been demanded for so long. And there's so many great

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competing titles out there now that they're not as dominant as

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they once were. So I love the shift to free to play at opens

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up your game to a wider audience, there are so many kids

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out there that can't afford a 6070 even a 40 or $30 game. So

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going free to play to me is always a great thing. You want

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your IP in his front of as many eyeballs as possible. Otherwise,

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there's nothing to monetize in the first place. And it's just

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kind of funny and unfortunate that that's where they're at.

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But it's a good move I think for for the Overwatch community and

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I don't know if it's a Hail Mary or or something that drastic. I

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don't think so. But it's it's definitely telling, right

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because we had this conversation a week ago and probably the week

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before that.

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What was it was the Strauss Zelnick story where they're

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actually raising the prices of their games. Right? And that's

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it. Oh, right. It was Call of Duty, excuse me.

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And so that's the difference here, right that we're looking

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at his call of duty, immensely popular game, tons of people

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still playing and even though I personally am frustrated by it

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and left, but but then when you compare it to Overwatch, which

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is in a very different scenario, taking the opposite, really

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interesting to see one parent company taking both routes,

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right and kind of a b testing, which is going to be the most

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successful, but I think it kind of just proves that it's not one

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or the other, but a more of a matter of circumstance. You guys

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think that this signals that Activision Blizzard's concerned

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about how many people are going to play the game?

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Yeah, I don't think I would go that broad to draw. I mean, they

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probably are concerned but I don't know that. I would

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necessarily draw that conclusion just in this. I think this is a

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move that

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It's kind of been coming in the industry a lot more and more

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where we've seen a movement really away from loot boxes

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towards like the Battle Pass system. fortnight did that Apex

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legends did that they still may use a little bit of loot box

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mechanics, but it's largely that Battle Pass system that drives

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the monetization versus like one off or pay to win type blue box

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style mechanics. So I think it's I think it's more that you know,

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broadly than anything else. Yeah. Once a year, we're gonna

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say something. Oh, yeah, I just when I when you first were

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reading the story, I thought, okay, who cares? Nobody likes

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this game anyway. So I suppose my sort of hot take is that loot

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boxes are no loot boxes. This doesn't really matter that

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people are disappointed in Overwatch to you with an

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Activision didn't do the type of pivot it needed to save the

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franchise in the first place.

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So yes, I think they're concerned about player base.

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Like, Doesn't this feel a little bit inconsistent to you? Like

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last week, we had the discussion about Call of Duty raising the

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price by $10. Right. And the conclusion there seemed to be

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something to the effect of, we know people are gonna buy Call

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of Duty anyways. Right? And so you can raise it $10 $15

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Whatever, people are still going to pay it. That was sort of

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correct me if I'm wrong, kind of the conclusion we all came to.

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With Overwatch, it's maybe a little bit different story,

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right? There's definitely not as much.

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My belief around Overwatch is there's a hardcore group of

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people still playing Overwatch one who are going to play

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Overwatch too. So why not take the same attitude of well, the

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people who are going to play Overwatch too are going to play

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Overwatch too. So we should charge 50 bucks for it or 30

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bucks for it anyways, right? Like, why? Why make it free to

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play if you know that there's a player base that's going to

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adopt your game anyways.

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You know, the only reason I see the change? Sorry, go ahead,

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Jeff. Isn't the single player still gonna be I think what

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they're doing is basically separate and multiplayer in the

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single player, which kind of makes sense if you think you

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make the multiplayer free to play, and then monetize it with

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microtransactions. So you kind of like Jimmy said, broaden the

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base, bring as many people into the top of the funnel as

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possible. Plus, you get those network effects you don't want

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to be a multiplayer game doesn't have enough players. So people

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start dropping out because they can't find matches, and then

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they're going to still charge I believe for the

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the story missions and Conklin like the PvE modes, I believe

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that was the take that there are the rather than going down,

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which I think actually makes sense. It's a bit of like the

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opposite of the war zone approach where war zone started

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with the free paid game then shifted to free play and it's

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kind of the opposite there.

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It's an interesting point. It's sort of consistent with cod,

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though, where the single player games paid and the multiplayer

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battle royale is free to play. Maybe there that's the

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consistency. Let me just get caught up on comments here. Matt

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says, How can you not like this for Overwatch too? Isn't it

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possible that this solves all the issues people were talking

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about? When the beat first came out? Making it Free to Play

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seems really smart.

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Just don't make it like Diablo immortal, like you said, I mean,

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in game store, I think is definitely going to get less

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backlash than loot boxes, right? Like just on a

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apples to apples comparison. If all other things are equal,

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better to be able to buy the cosmetics you want than a loot

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box, you don't know what you're gonna get. Does anyone disagree

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with that?

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I mean, clearly,

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this is better.

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It's just interesting that they make a whole announcement that

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of it. I don't know that this is what I'm trying to read into.

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Right? Like, what are they trying to accomplish with the PR

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around it? And it says probably a Microsoft direction. There's

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not a single first party Microsoft game released in the

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last couple of years that I can think of that is still doing

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loot boxes. They've all moved to stores. I wonder also, what are

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the economics of loot boxes versus stores in terms of

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average spend per user? I don't know if any of you guys know or

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have seen data around that. Jeff, maybe you have.

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I'm guessing you see more people send in the store like a greater

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percentage of the overall population will spend. But maybe

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the dollar spent is lower because with microtransactions

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or sorry loot boxes, you get those whales that like just have

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an item they need to get so they'll spend $1,000 to get

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through to get it versus the store. Maybe you have more

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people spend like a greater percentage of people but they

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spend an hour because they just buy the one I want. Just my

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hypothesis. It's an interesting one. It sounds sounds

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reasonable implausible. Matt says like it feels like they're

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desperately trying to not make another Diablo immortal, which

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seems like a good idea if you ask me. I mean, I did see

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somewhere that Diablo immortal made like 25 million bucks so

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far, but that seems like such a huge amount in the grand scheme

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of Activision Blizzard, but

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maybe they're not the same actors Blizzard has always been

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kind of deaf to the backlash against them anyways, so I don't

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know. I don't know if it's a reaction. Adam says I Adam D

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says I think they're worried about the game being popular in

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the player base, but they're basically implementing the

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system within Call of Duty. Yeah, I think Adams the that's

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that's the that's basically the conclusion here that it's

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consistent with Call of Duty, which is maybe what they're

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trying to standardize, like, give multiplayer away, monetize

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through in game stores and charge for single player

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campaigns.

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But I also agree that they are worried about the player base.

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That Mr. Says the same reason they made the Hinsdale Halo

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infinite multiplayer free to play. They need people playing

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this is true for multiplayer to succeed, you cannot have 15

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minute queue times or you know, whatever they would be if if

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maybe you gated it with a $30 charge.

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Because I just want to put this next to hang on. I don't have

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the story queued up, but I wanted to put it next to another

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story.

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Sorry, one second, because I thought I don't think this plays

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into it that much. But I do think it plays into it maybe a

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little bit. And this was I was watching asmin gold stream in

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fact, and he was reacting to a video. Let me bring this up

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here.

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So the story here is US Senator Ted Cruz agrees to roundtable

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meeting with asmin gold on outline, pay to win

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microtransactions. So asmin gold has been like incredibly

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outspoken on how Diablo immortal basically needs to die, that

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it's the worst thing that's ever happened to gaming and I agree

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with him. And and somehow this made it to the he made contact

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supposedly, with US senator Ted Cruz's office to talk about

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making pay to win microtransactions. And in fact,

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when I saw Ted Cruz's reaction or or comment on this, he

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expanded it to loot boxes, so pay to win microtransactions and

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loot boxes illegal. So supposedly asmin gold's talking

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to Ted Cruz, about putting legislation to make pay to win

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microtransactions and loot boxes illegal. Now, I put it here

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because obviously we just talked about Overwatch to getting rid

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of loot boxes. Do you think there's concern from any of the

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big players that maybe loot boxes will get regulated more

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heavily in the US and they need to change now?

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Lindsey, maybe I don't know if you have thoughts on this. Yeah,

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I mean, there definitely should be

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legislation in and laws in general are historically

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extremely slow to move, but can be, I suppose quite damaging or

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quite harsh when they eventually go through. I don't think that

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there's any justification for needing to immediately fix this,

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considering I went to an FTC hearing on loot boxes, like

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three years ago, and obviously, nothing has particularly changed

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since then. Um,

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I think it would be wise to move away from that as the

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monetization model in general, just because I think that

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there's a lot of pushback from fans as well. So I don't think

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that this is like a thing to do right now, like all irons in the

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fire kind of alarm. But I do think that it would be wise to

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move away from that and find other forms of monetization for

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several reasons. One of them being the potential for

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legislation down the road.

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Any other thoughts guys on this?

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I think I agree with everything Lindsay said. I doubt that this

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came though, as a result of the Ted Cruz asmin gold thing. It's

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just it's, it's too quick, right? Like these companies like

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this, don't make decisions that quickly, right? Like, it's not

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like they changed the entire monetization design of this

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multi 100 million dollar game that building based on like, one

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tweak content groups, it's just, it's just not that wouldn't be

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how it would go down.

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It's something that you see in traditional sports also, right,

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like the top athletes are going to use their voice and their

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status to try and implement change, or at least to try and

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make headlines. But the thing here is, I mean, what's Ted Cruz

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going to do at the end of the day that hasn't already been

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discussed, like Lindsay said three years ago. See, just

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getting publicity from from this demographic, right and kind of

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taking advantage of a hot topic where you can get in front of

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new eyeballs

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I don't want to criticize him or any political candidate too much

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on the show. It's just,

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you know, gamers don't like to feel exploited fundamentally, is

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what we're talking about here. You have a very well known gamer

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that's very vocal against that. And is this going to lead to any

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true change remains the question, and I don't think

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there's an answer for that. You know, it's kind of how I'm

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looking at this. So it's a fun story. It's cool to see the

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names attached to it. But I just don't have a lot of hope, I

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think for anything immediate.

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Hey, I want to just take one one poll here. And I want to ask

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chat, also, probability that loot boxes get regulated and I

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probably mean banned in the US in the next two years.

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Where would you guys put that probability? Yeah. Zero. Jeff

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says zero. Lindsey.

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You're muted. She's with me. She couldn't

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bear saying that out loud.

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Now, within two years to

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zero, you also 03 zeros. Come on. I mean, percent. That

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statement, it says a lot more about my beliefs about the US

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political.

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Versus like, what I really believe about loot boxes, or

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should they be banned or anything like that. It's just

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like, we can't pass anything in this country that is remotely

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sensible. So it's very unlikely you're gonna get you know,

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enough people on board to do that. We're not to that. It's

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just like it's gonna grow into all and everything else. It's

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not an issue that people care about that said that people were

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going to take it up a champion, just not that important to be

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fair, not at all. Ademar says, Wait, which announcement came

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first, the asmin gold or Overwatch? I think technically,

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the asmin gold one came first. The Overwatch announcement was a

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few days later. So read into that as well.

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Kevin says hasn't EU law taken aim at loot boxes already? I

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think the Netherlands did already. Yes, Kevin. They did.

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But I don't know if there was a hard like ban on them, I think

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was more aimed at like stopping kids from gambling.

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That has always been sort of the way to that most governments

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have tried to sort of go after loot boxes. Although, recently I

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think we covered this couple of weeks back where I think it was

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Belgium. Basically, their subversion of the Supreme Court

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effectively said that loot boxes were not can so it was like a

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big step in the wrong direction for the the anti loot box

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regulators. Yeah.

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Michael says this is new schedule change, Michael. Yes,

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we're, as I mentioned at the top of the show, if you missed it,

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we're trying out a new time. We're trying to reach more time

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zones if you love it, if you hate it, let us know.

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By but so far, the feedback has been good. So let us know if you

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if you hate it you prefer doing this at night or in the morning

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or whenever? Brian says asmin gold Ted Cruz loot boxes What a

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time to be alive. I mean, it's fun that it's it's in the part

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of the conversation, right, like, but to Lindsay's point

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it's been part of it feels like it's been part of the

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conversation for a few years now. I disagree with you guys

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that at 0%. I actually think over the next two years, it's

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probably like a 5050 Toss up. Truly like a 5050 Toss up.

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That I think I think the whole idea of kids gambling,

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eventually, people decide to do something about it. But I don't

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know, what do I know. Ademar says streamlabs got called out

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by regular people on Twitter for copying other companies. And

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within a day they issued a statement saying, Oh, hey, we

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messed up, we'll fix it.

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I mean, Ademar you're implying that Overwatch two came out with

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this announcement after the asmin gold thing? I agree that

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that the decisions that are being made that quickly and that

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haphazardly because they sort of have always been made that

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haphazardly at Activision Blizzard. So I do think they may

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be connected, but I think it's more likely that they're just

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worried about the player base is my guess. Kevin says zero. Wow,

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Kevin agrees with all of you guys. All of you guys think 0%

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Zero. Like not no chance impossible. Adam D says 10% That

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feels a little more reasonable to me. At least some chance.

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Kevin says of all the things to focus on lol Come on now. Kevin,

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we gotta get rid of pay to win and Diablo immortal says this is

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the most important issue facing America today.

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Adam Ademar ces two years 05 years depends on who has a

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majority in Congress. So Ademar I think you agree with Jeff on

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this one that it's more of a

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The statement of the political systems

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not to get into a political compasses but who which side

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dancing like I don't know, you know like the right is all about

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free enterprise we really gonna ban you know

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microtransactions and video games it seems very like anti

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liberal conservatism and then the left like I don't know

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I just don't know whose political issue like who makes

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hay from it I'm just not sure I feel like that has been gold's

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political issue

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platform candidate as

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family values party, you're gonna get a weird group, you're

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gonna get the like, anti black folks and the like, extreme

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family values, folks. And it's gonna be a strange unity of

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people that have nothing to do with Democrat and Republican.

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If anything,

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Kevin says what are the chances California takes aim at it? I

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would assume Activision Blizzard and is a big political donor in

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California, I would think right, like, I would assume they have

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political influence or their their lobbying there. And they

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would not want that considering. I mean, almost all their mobile

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stuff is loot boxes still, right? Like most of the King

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stuff is all loot boxes, basically, or some version of

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Microsoft pay to win microtransactions.

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So I would assume they would be pretty wholeheartedly against

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it. And um, so MD says slow clap for Jeff

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says no way will loot box be banned in the US, especially

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since the country is starting to loosen up, loosen up its

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gambling laws. That's that's a good point. That's actually good

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point. All right, maybe I'm not 5050 Maybe I'm 10%. Maybe I'm

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with

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added D on this same 10%. I don't think it's zero, I could

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actually cut both ways. I mean, that would be state by state,

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which is how the gambling laws are being done. But you could

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see some element of when a state is legalized gambling, they

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actually tightened other areas where it's like, you know, they

Unknown:

decided to legalize sports betting but part of the bill

Unknown:

that's negotiated they end up banning these sort of like

Unknown:

mobile microtransactions pseudo sheath like pseudo gambling, if

Unknown:

you call it, I don't think that will happen. But you could make

Unknown:

that.

Unknown:

Guys, let's move on. Let's talk about Team Liquid in the news.

Unknown:

And for those of you who watch all our content, or consume all

Unknown:

our content, this is something

Unknown:

William the professor calluses. latest episode of office hours

Unknown:

he touches on this topic, we're going to talk about Team Liquid

Unknown:

here. But if you haven't watched an episode of office hours with

Unknown:

the professor, go do that. It's, it's it, we put it in the same

Unknown:

feed as all the other business of esports stuff. It's really

Unknown:

great. He does a deep dive once a week on one specific topic.

Unknown:

And this this week was on Team Liquid and Honda so let me let

Unknown:

me bring this up here the story was Team Liquid and Honda

Unknown:

announced naming rights deal. So Teamliquid announced a

Unknown:

significant partnership with car manufacturer Honda, the new

Unknown:

multi year deal will see Honda secure naming rights to the

Unknown:

organization's League of Legends, LCS and Academy teams,

Unknown:

so they will compete in the LCS under the name team, liquid

Unknown:

Honda.

Unknown:

It'll be on their jerseys, you know, all the usual stuff. And

Unknown:

they've been they've been they've been teamed up since

Unknown:

2019. So Todd does not new to Team Liquid. But this naming

Unknown:

rights deal is new. I'm curious what you guys think of the team

Unknown:

naming rights stuff. And I ask, you know, from a business

Unknown:

standpoint, right, like, who the question I usually ask, like,

Unknown:

who who's the bigger winner here? Right? Is this? This

Unknown:

better for Team Liquid or better for Honda without knowing how

Unknown:

much Team Liquid actually got for this? But the second

Unknown:

question I have is, why don't we see this more in North American

Unknown:

traditional sports, but it seems to be getting more accepted in

Unknown:

esports. Right? We saw TSM FTX. Now Team Liquid Honda, like why

Unknown:

don't we see the, the, you know, the h&m, New York Yankees or

Unknown:

whatever, like, you know what I mean? Like my, why is that not?

Unknown:

Like why is because they don't need as much money as the

Unknown:

esports teams need because they have broadcast deals. The big

Unknown:

problem in esports is that they there's no substitute for the

Unknown:

massive TV contracts that we've seen, really pretty much every

Unknown:

other sport. That doesn't happen in esports. We've seen some

Unknown:

deals nothing nearly of the magnitude. And the big question,

Unknown:

I feel like we've been talking for five years the industry has

Unknown:

about hey, these big TV contracts are coming. That's

Unknown:

where the catch up opportunity will be to

Unknown:

In traditional sports and real estate and esports, hasn't

Unknown:

really happened, my sort of like working hypothesis is that

Unknown:

there's just too much free content out there on platforms

Unknown:

like Twitch, and YouTube and stuff like that where it's a

Unknown:

good substitute, right? If you think about basketball, there's

Unknown:

no great substitute for watching, like the Lakers versus

Unknown:

the bowls. Next,

Unknown:

where's esports? There's a pretty good substitute. If you

Unknown:

just go on Twitch and watch, you know, who could pick your

Unknown:

favorite streamer? Like, that's a pretty good substitute for any

Unknown:

esports match if you're not a hardcore fan of a team, so it

Unknown:

keeps it keeps the right staff. So that's, that's the big

Unknown:

problem. So get back to your initial question. These teams

Unknown:

need money, so they're willing to literally sell their own

Unknown:

name.

Unknown:

Yeah, I want to jump in here. I think that's I think Jeff had a

Unknown:

lot of it on its head, you know, that one, the lack of, or

Unknown:

rather, the sheer amount of content where it makes it less

Unknown:

of a competitive product. And also, you know, what the teams

Unknown:

need, right? In traditional sports versus esports. You know,

Unknown:

I had this conversation about this exact story with a

Unknown:

marketing representative for another very well known global

Unknown:

car manufacturing brand. And, you know, we both came to the

Unknown:

same conclusion in that this was a pretty standard partnership,

Unknown:

it was pretty basic, there was nothing that really excited

Unknown:

either of us seem to be a create more value for Team Liquid, I

Unknown:

think more than Honda here, just because Honda is one of those

Unknown:

global I mean, not the team that liquid small by any means. But

Unknown:

it's not Honda status, doesn't have Honda's history or reach.

Unknown:

But but at the end of the day, it's like, what, what is this,

Unknown:

you know, there, there was an opportunity for Honda, who's

Unknown:

spending marketing dollars for this, for this brand deal, where

Unknown:

Honda could have been a little bit more engaged, they could

Unknown:

have created more content, they could have gone directly to the

Unknown:

motorsports side of competitive gaming, which is a really

Unknown:

interesting place. I mean, the group of us saw the esports f1

Unknown:

activation in Austin. And that's just one element of it, where

Unknown:

there were lines in Austin, Texas, you know, for people to

Unknown:

compete and hop on these, these VR machinery and not VR, but but

Unknown:

those those simulator rigs. So it seems like a not a missed

Unknown:

opportunity for Honda, but really not as meaningful as it

Unknown:

could have been were on it could have done something, again, on

Unknown:

the motorsports side of things, or just more than just like,

Unknown:

here's a bunch of money, put our name on your T shirt, you know,

Unknown:

not that this isn't a big news that it's not a great win for

Unknown:

esports because it is a non endemic brand. You know, like

Unknown:

the Nissan FES do that we had seen.

Unknown:

But it's not unique. And I don't want to bag it for that or rag

Unknown:

on it for that. But

Unknown:

I don't know, maybe it's because we cover all the top news

Unknown:

stories and all the trending things every single week that

Unknown:

we're ahead of the curve over a year, I would like to think, but

Unknown:

you would hope for something a little bit more. Even though

Unknown:

this is still a win for esports. It's just, it's not the

Unknown:

evolution that I would hope to see. Because I just want to hang

Unknown:

on I want to read this. Adam VSAs good on them for the

Unknown:

partnership. But liquid Honda is awful, in my opinion. I mean,

Unknown:

this is where I sort of want it to take this Doesn't this feel

Unknown:

incredibly lazy, incredibly lazy as an activation? Because I get

Unknown:

why a brand wants to put their name on a stadium, right?

Unknown:

Because there's probably 100,000 cars that pass by the biggest

Unknown:

stadiums every single day. And you know, if you see you know,

Unknown:

TD Bank or whatever up in lights on the stadium, or Gillette or

Unknown:

whatever, you know that

Unknown:

that has value because you're getting eyeballs from just the

Unknown:

people who pass by this giant thing every single day. The

Unknown:

reality is, is there anyone who's actually going to call

Unknown:

this like, Team Liquid Honda? Like are the casters gonna call

Unknown:

them Team Liquid Honda, or the like, the fans gonna refer to

Unknown:

them as Team Liquid Honda? Probably not right? This is

Unknown:

still probably just Team Liquid. And so I didn't know what Honda

Unknown:

really gets with naming rights. I feel like there were 100 other

Unknown:

better ways to activate with the team to get people excited about

Unknown:

the Honda brand.

Unknown:

This feels lazy to me. I don't know what I will say I agree

Unknown:

with you. What I will say is, especially with a non endemic

Unknown:

brand, maybe they're just dipping their toe in the water.

Unknown:

You know, we did have Steve Aaron set on the show a couple

Unknown:

of months ago, he spoke to the incredibly high. I think it was

Unknown:

100% return rate from their sponsors, wasn't it? I thought

Unknown:

it was 100 where the sponsors that they work with come back

Unknown:

every single year because of that relationship. This is the

Unknown:

first relationship that Han is having with liquid so maybe it's

Unknown:

the start of something, but to your point I'm not out here

Unknown:

saying team TSM FTX

Unknown:

Right. So what is this accomplishing? Really, other

Unknown:

than Honda taking a dip in a new field? Which is why I said, you

Unknown:

know, it seemed like a missed opportunity for dipping their

Unknown:

toe. It's almost like they skipped all the steps in the

Unknown:

ground for the whole

Unknown:

you know, they could have started with a simple like

Unknown:

Jersey patch instead they're like, No, change your name. Like

Unknown:

that's, that's literally about as deep as you can think about

Unknown:

it. Like, literally change the name, though I do agree. But

Unknown:

it's also the lowest value thing, right? Like if, if Honda

Unknown:

tomorrow came and said, Hey, business of esports here's

Unknown:

millions of dollars, we want you to change your name to business

Unknown:

of esports Honda, right? Like, is anyone gonna call the show

Unknown:

that right? Is are people gonna be like, Oh my god, I tune in to

Unknown:

the business of esports Honda livestream every week. No,

Unknown:

there's people are still gonna call it business of esports

Unknown:

there are probably better ways we can get Honda's brand in

Unknown:

front of our audience. And I think there are better ways

Unknown:

Teamliquid can connect Honda in their audience more creative

Unknown:

ways than just renaming. That's absolutely great. To be fair,

Unknown:

they may also they did mention, I think one of the articles I've

Unknown:

read they're doing some additional stuff like they're

Unknown:

gonna have a lounge it's called the Honda lounge. I'm sure the

Unknown:

jerseys will have on the I imagine the players will drive

Unknown:

around like there's probably other stuff besides just the

Unknown:

name. But I think you're right we could get there are better.

Unknown:

There are more creative ways to

Unknown:

just like slapping a name that you're right. Most people will

Unknown:

not say now it will be on the jerseys. It will be on the

Unknown:

scoreboard it will be on the press kits and all the articles

Unknown:

will obviously have to say Honda liquid, so it'll be there. But

Unknown:

like when we're talking about a day to day in the vernacular,

Unknown:

like we're not going to probably call it Honda. Although maybe we

Unknown:

will now because we thought this competition.

Unknown:

You're all missing the point here. Well, it evokes so many

Unknown:

emotions. It's whimsical, it's imaginative. It gets you going

Unknown:

it makes me laugh. I think it's great. I don't

Unknown:

think liquid on those all day, actually.

Unknown:

Now but I actually in the absence of enormous broadcast,

Unknown:

right skills, I love seeing things like go through and I'm

Unknown:

happy for Team Liquid to get a sponsor on board hopefully show

Unknown:

them the wide world of esports maybe half the sponsor something

Unknown:

else then and keep money flowing into the industry. So Oh,

Unknown:

hilarious. I love some of these comments. Lindsay to your point

Unknown:

here. Omar says I would hate if my Honda was made of liquid.

Unknown:

This Kennison weird. Adam D says having honden Jersey similar to

Unknown:

branding in the EU soccer teams is 100 times better than

Unknown:

changing the name to liquid Honda. I mean, to be fair, I

Unknown:

think they do have the patches that they do have. They did say

Unknown:

they were gonna have names on the Jersey but I agree liquid

Unknown:

Honda is weird. Ademar says the Honda lounge where the PCs are

Unknown:

as powerful as a lawn mower.

Unknown:

This is guys you should be you should have done this activation

Unknown:

chat should have done this activation. And Mr. Says Honda

Unknown:

Civic Si themed gaming chairs. I mean gaming chairs already our

Unknown:

car like racing bucket seat. So that's not a stretch.

Unknown:

Kevin says it seems like the sports is following the European

Unknown:

European Jersey style with branding included like soccer,

Unknown:

rugby, Euro basketball, meanwhile, the US has been slow

Unknown:

to get there. I mean, to just point it, the US maybe doesn't

Unknown:

need to go there right like the the big North American sports

Unknown:

teams, because they just don't need the money themselves the

Unknown:

brand. I mean, they're they are doing some Jersey patch

Unknown:

sponsorships like in the NBA.

Unknown:

But it's like they don't need to sell their naming rights because

Unknown:

they just make so much money that it would cheap in their

Unknown:

overall brand.

Unknown:

What is interesting is that we don't see more and maybe we do

Unknown:

see this a little bit. But like I was thinking of the analogy

Unknown:

like golf, every tournament seems to be sponsored by some of

Unknown:

the like the Honda classic.

Unknown:

The RBC the Barclays, like every event seems to have like a title

Unknown:

sponsor. And it really works because then the whole week

Unknown:

you're hearing about, hey, who's winning the Barclays tournament?

Unknown:

Who's winning the Honda classic? Like it's just, you know, I

Unknown:

think it actually might be better than this. So I'm

Unknown:

surprised we don't see more of that. And he's

Unknown:

I have I've had funny thoughts about that exact thing, Jeff

Unknown:

with golf, because there's one tournament which is called the

Unknown:

waste management open. And every time I go

Unknown:

What a horrible name for a tournament like, I get that it's

Unknown:

the corporate sponsor, but it's a horrible name for a tournament

Unknown:

like this is horrible branding, but maybe it works because I

Unknown:

always remember it.

Unknown:

And it's you know, it's

Unknown:

big golf tournament. But I don't know if naming the naming

Unknown:

anything after the sponsor helps the sponsor really, I'm not

Unknown:

convinced. Let's put it that way.

Unknown:

Guys, before we get to the next story, I just want to say a

Unknown:

quick word, this live stream very generously sponsored by

Unknown:

YouGov. If you're working in or around the gaming space at all,

Unknown:

you're looking to reach esports, fans,

Unknown:

gaming, the gamers gaming audience at all, you need to be

Unknown:

talking to you guys, they produce something called Live

Unknown:

data. So it's data that's constantly being updated, it's

Unknown:

incredibly powerful helps to make really great decisions, I

Unknown:

would not go alone, I would not try and get into the gaming

Unknown:

space or reach the gaming audience at all, unless you've

Unknown:

talked to people like you go first. So if you need to reach

Unknown:

them, you can reach any of us directly, and we can put you in

Unknown:

contact with them. Or you can go to yougov.com/boe in fact, go

Unknown:

there anyways, I'm gonna put it in all the chats that I can you

Unknown:

gov.com/boe There's some free data there. There's some videos

Unknown:

from past live streams we've done with YouGov. And so there's

Unknown:

a lot of interesting things there. Go check it out. Go show

Unknown:

you give some love. We really appreciate their support. Is it

Unknown:

true? Offered $100 million to change the name of the of the

Unknown:

live stream to the use of businesses esports live stream

Unknown:

we true. And we did turned down it is true. Those I can confirm

Unknown:

those rumors.

Unknown:

Ademar says waste management seems appropriate for golf. Ah,

Unknown:

okay.

Unknown:

Totally unnecessary shot at golf.

Unknown:

When you said that, though? Hey, well.

Unknown:

Totally unnecessary shot at golf. All right, guys, let's

Unknown:

let's talk about a subject where maybe we were all wrong. I don't

Unknown:

know. I don't know if it's one of those cases. Or maybe we were

Unknown:

all right, that doesn't go. This could go both ways. And it's

Unknown:

about Netflix games. And finally, some data coming out.

Unknown:

This is from Sensor Tower, Netflix games, reach 13 million

Unknown:

downloads. So according to the report,

Unknown:

Netflix games have generated 13 million downloads globally since

Unknown:

launching them last year.

Unknown:

The most popular month for the platform, in terms of downloads

Unknown:

was December, which had 2.3 million. And this is

Unknown:

incidentally, when their second most popular game launch

Unknown:

ashphalt extreme.

Unknown:

They've been doing this less than a year. Everything launched

Unknown:

last November. There's 24 titles more on the horizon that we've

Unknown:

talked about, including a Stranger Things title. What do

Unknown:

you guys think of this number? 13 million downloads 2.3 million

Unknown:

in their best month?

Unknown:

Netflix games a success? Not really? Where are we right?

Unknown:

Where are we wrong?

Unknown:

Just for context. So the company I work for Home games, which

Unknown:

many maybe you may or may not have heard of in the last month

Unknown:

had 37 million downloads. So downloads in in mobile gaming

Unknown:

are not.

Unknown:

It's not always equivalent, you know? So

Unknown:

I guess

Unknown:

times as much as Netflix is game Netflix's best month? Yeah. So

Unknown:

it's Yeah, I mean, I would say that you're basically calling

Unknown:

Netflix games and nothing burger a little bit. Yeah, I mean, I

Unknown:

still maintain I don't think they're doing enough. And now to

Unknown:

be fair, they're probably not spending a ton on user

Unknown:

acquisition debt. You have to be a Netflix subscriber, you have

Unknown:

to be in the Netflix app to find them. So there's a lot of

Unknown:

reasons why 13 million may actually be a good start for

Unknown:

Netflix. And they may be better than or worse than they

Unknown:

expected. But just off the top like 13 million to me is not

Unknown:

like a wow, this is you know, taking over the world bumper.

Unknown:

Jimmy Lindsey, any thoughts? Maybe? I mean, in different

Unknown:

context. Do you guys know offhand? Netflix's total

Unknown:

subscriber numbers? I googled it immediately. Yeah. So it's about

Unknown:

222 million. So 13 is about half a percent of their total user

Unknown:

base, making a download, which I still think is pretty on par

Unknown:

with their strategy like they're not releasing huge. I do I still

Unknown:

feel like they're in the early phases. I will be I think it

Unknown:

does worse if the stranger stranger thing game does poorly

Unknown:

that I think they need to rethink it. But I think so far

Unknown:

they haven't released a massive I mean, they've released like

Unknown:

the Queen's gambit and some other like, decent Netflix IP,

Unknown:

but they haven't released a game that's like,

Unknown:

nearly as popular as one of their most popular shows like

Unknown:

Stranger Things. So I still feel like they're sort of dipping

Unknown:

their toe

Unknown:

When and maybe it's Stranger Things is more of the game that

Unknown:

makes the plunge.

Unknown:

So, I mean, are you guys concluding that too early?

Unknown:

Because I know the context, you put this in sort of paints

Unknown:

Netflix's gaming efforts in a bad light here, but like,

Unknown:

do you?

Unknown:

Do you agree that with Lindsey that maybe it's too early to

Unknown:

call or? Early? It's definitely too early? I definitely, I have

Unknown:

been critical of Netflix. But that comparison was more just to

Unknown:

give scale and and to say like, Haha, Netflix you're doing so

Unknown:

poorly because we don't know what they're optimizing for yet

Unknown:

right? They may it may be all about retention. So those 13

Unknown:

million people they may have some estimate of Okay, now we've

Unknown:

gotten them to stick around Netflix for an extra month. So

Unknown:

that's worth $12. So boom, we just made, you know, $200

Unknown:

million. Based on that calculation. We don't know that

Unknown:

maybe those 12 million, 2 million of them were not Netflix

Unknown:

subscribers previously, and they joined the service to play the

Unknown:

Netflix game. So oh my god, that would be like amazing. If they

Unknown:

made 2 million new subscribers. I doubt either of those things.

Unknown:

Ace, but I guess the point is without that extra context, but

Unknown:

what they're optimizing for, we clearly can't say whether this

Unknown:

is success or failure.

Unknown:

That that clarification, I think was super helpful, Jeff, and I

Unknown:

didn't take it in a negative way. When you shared your own

Unknown:

insights. I thought that was like, wow. Okay, so this is the

Unknown:

higher end of the spectrum that we're weighing against. And you

Unknown:

provide an excellent context. What I will say is that the fact

Unknown:

that it's even up for debate to me shows that it's successful,

Unknown:

because if it was anything less, and if it was an instant

Unknown:

failure, we would just be branding it as an instant

Unknown:

failure. Look at this, it barely clear 2 million or 5 million

Unknown:

downloads, the fact that it did over 10 million, and we're

Unknown:

actually at 13. I think that's pretty impressive. It's a start.

Unknown:

And, you know, now we have one data point to talk about, and

Unknown:

we'll see where like, like Jeff just said, We'll see where they

Unknown:

take it, and where we're the next release or what those next

Unknown:

few years are. But honestly, I think if it were a failure, we

Unknown:

would more easily classify it as that the fact that there's even

Unknown:

a question about it, to me, indicates that it's pretty, that

Unknown:

it's at least successful in its own right. And there will be

Unknown:

more discussion to be had around it.

Unknown:

And let me just read the comments here, that Omar says

Unknown:

there's a small percentage of games based on films shows that

Unknown:

have done well. But the ones that are done well do really

Unknown:

well. So it's a risk, but it couldn't be high reward. I mean,

Unknown:

that's true, right? Like Stranger Things could, could be

Unknown:

incredibly successful, given you know, how popular the show is.

Unknown:

But it could also be a horrible, like, just because it's usually

Unknown:

using Stranger Things. IP doesn't guarantee success, as

Unknown:

we've, I think discussed many, many times. Chris says, Hey,

Unknown:

Chris, last week's guest on this live stream. Chris, by the way,

Unknown:

everyone has said how amazing you were both on the podcast

Unknown:

episode and on the live stream, and how much they love the show

Unknown:

with you. It says half a percent. That's about the

Unknown:

penetration of esports fans to video games. So chalk it up as

Unknown:

All right. Okay. Take taking a shot at esports. Kevin says 13%

Unknown:

of 220 million is over 28 million.

Unknown:

Where's the 30?

Unknown:

million downloads? Not percent? Yeah, yeah. 13 million

Unknown:

downloads.

Unknown:

And then again, we're the half percent assumes each download

Unknown:

was from?

Unknown:

Yeah, it's 5%. I, my decimal places were off. But 5% is

Unknown:

assuming each individual download was from a separate

Unknown:

Netflix user, right? Because you could have one Netflix user

Unknown:

download three games. And therefore it would be a smaller

Unknown:

percentage of the of the total Netflix user base or viewer

Unknown:

base. Matt says you have to imagine Netflix is happy with

Unknown:

this. Why else would they release these download numbers?

Unknown:

I mean, we don't know that they released them.

Unknown:

I don't think the article said it was this was from a third

Unknown:

party reports

Unknown:

how they're getting the data. I'm not sure but

Unknown:

this this wasn't a PR fluff piece from Netflix. That's for

Unknown:

sure.

Unknown:

Matt says it seems easier to make a successful show out of a

Unknown:

game that to make a successful game out of a show. Do you guys

Unknown:

all agree with that?

Unknown:

Anyone disagree? Let's see how the Queen's gambit just came

Unknown:

does it just just launched? We just talked about it. So no, I'm

Unknown:

not sure Matt that's always the age old question. Right is is

Unknown:

how this IP is applied and and where it is. Where where it has

Unknown:

the strongest start.

Unknown:

Shows are hard to make too.

Unknown:

You know, games aren't the only you I think we're biased here

Unknown:

because we're all gaming, you know, related or gaming centric.

Unknown:

But shows are very hard to do.

Unknown:

I mean, look at Halo, that was not a great show.

Unknown:

So I think it's more of a team. It's

Unknown:

the trope was like taking games and making movies other than was

Unknown:

like, a disaster like, it never worked. I think in the last

Unknown:

three years, we've seen a lot of examples of games being turned

Unknown:

into shows that have worked. So maybe that is not necessarily

Unknown:

the case anymore. But historically, I think it was

Unknown:

always like, it always fails when you tried to make a movie.

Unknown:

Chris says, Thanks for the kind words love the new time, Chris,

Unknown:

that that feedback is really important. Thank you. We really

Unknown:

want to know if you guys liked this new time, as I mentioned,

Unknown:

so please, please continue letting us know even if it's in

Unknown:

messages after the fact, if you're listening to this, even

Unknown:

after the fact, and maybe you're usually here live, let us know.

Unknown:

And Omar says The Witcher is the exception, not the rule.

Unknown:

True? Sure. But it's a strong example the strong it's a strong

Unknown:

sort of thing to point to and you could look at League and

Unknown:

arcane, I mean,

Unknown:

TV shows that come from games seem to be seem to have done

Unknown:

pretty well recently. Alright guys, I want to get to I want to

Unknown:

get to a couple final stories here.

Unknown:

And this is razor in the news. Razor is bit of a twist on this

Unknown:

one. The headline here is gaming hardware giant razors venture

Unknown:

arm leads, 4 million investment in Singapore crypto payments

Unknown:

startup. So this is z ventures it's the venture arm of Razer

Unknown:

for million dollar funding round and triple A, it's a crypto

Unknown:

payments startup based in Singapore. So basically, it says

Unknown:

I want to read the statement from the chief strategy offer

Unknown:

officer raiser where he says AAA is a clear leader in crypto

Unknown:

payments, an area of interest in relevance to us in the gaming

Unknown:

space, we look forward to the strategic partnership with them,

Unknown:

accelerating their growth and adoption by leveraging on our

Unknown:

existing ecosystem of hardware, software and services.

Unknown:

And the idea is, what triple A does is that allows companies

Unknown:

and E commerce platforms like Razer has, or game developers to

Unknown:

accept payments in crypto. So

Unknown:

I don't know what you guys want to make of this, you know, I

Unknown:

was, I was like following what the hardware companies are

Unknown:

doing, and especially when they're doing different things

Unknown:

here. This could be just as simple as razor, you know, wants

Unknown:

to be able to sell keyboards and headsets and get paid in

Unknown:

Bitcoin. But I'm wondering if you think if there's any tinfoil

Unknown:

hat theories, your thoughts on where razor might be going with

Unknown:

this? Because I do think it's different. I have not seen any

Unknown:

other hardware company make a move like this.

Unknown:

What do you think? Is the thinking here for razor? And

Unknown:

what how does this play out?

Unknown:

Jimmy, if you have thoughts, or Lindsey Go ahead.

Unknown:

I was just gonna say my my most kind of tinfoil hat and

Unknown:

pie in the sky theory is that they'll start doing, they'll

Unknown:

start acting as an art arbiter, like, they'll create like a b2b

Unknown:

software as a service for gaming companies to be able to accept

Unknown:

payments through this company.

Unknown:

They don't typically do software as a service. So that would be

Unknown:

kind of a huge step outside of their normal. But if you're

Unknown:

talking about actual product,

Unknown:

then that's the only thing I could think of that razor could

Unknown:

potentially sell.

Unknown:

But

Unknown:

so so razor actually has a division called razor gold,

Unknown:

which handles payments for games and entertainment platforms. I

Unknown:

don't think it's one of their more advertiser known verticals.

Unknown:

But I think it has little to do if if other than it uses its own

Unknown:

software for their own payments of their gaming peripherals. I

Unknown:

think it has a little to do with the razor that we're all

Unknown:

familiar with. And then you guys might also be familiar with

Unknown:

razor or respond by razor right, which is kind of like their

Unknown:

their GM that they did in partnership and in some of their

Unknown:

other energy supplements and things of that nature to compete

Unknown:

with G Fuel to raise you're kind of doing a lot of different

Unknown:

things here under a couple of different umbrellas. And I have

Unknown:

less experience with Razer gold. I've talked to some people over

Unknown:

there and I'm excited to learn more, but I think this is a fit

Unknown:

for that. And maybe they're just looking to add crypto

Unknown:

capabilities for some of their b2b I think

Unknown:

services that they're offering under the razor gold vertical.

Unknown:

Either way, interesting time to get in.

Unknown:

Krypto probably something that's been months in the making, and

Unknown:

then, you know, unfortunate timing on the press release with

Unknown:

with the turmoil going on over there. But if you believe in the

Unknown:

long term, viability of that technology, as many crypto

Unknown:

adopters enthusiast do, then, you know, hey, this is where

Unknown:

you're still early days here. And I think there's going to be

Unknown:

a growing need for companies to transact in crypto currencies.

Unknown:

Guys, can I give you my thoughts on this? Because I thought, and

Unknown:

this is why I wanted to bring up the story because if you guys

Unknown:

remember, one of the early promises of crypto was really

Unknown:

like, in the early days of pay, walling news, right, and there

Unknown:

was this, there was this idea that there was a potential

Unknown:

future where if you want to read a news story,

Unknown:

you know, you could have there could be some way of paying two

Unknown:

cents, right, some like extremely small amount to be

Unknown:

able to read a news story. And this is how traditional

Unknown:

newspaper publishers, were going to make money online, right,

Unknown:

because they couldn't get people to buy subscriptions. And so it

Unknown:

was gonna be like, some one center two cents that you pay

Unknown:

per story. And over time, they make money on all these. Forget

Unknown:

about microtransactions, like nano transactions. And the

Unknown:

problem is with traditional payment systems, it's just not

Unknown:

feasible, right? Because you have transaction costs that are

Unknown:

far greater than the two or three pennies that you pay for

Unknown:

the story. And this is where crypto was touted as sort of the

Unknown:

solution to all of this, right? Where crypto could allow for

Unknown:

these extremely small transactions with low or no

Unknown:

transaction costs. And therefore it all works. Is there a world

Unknown:

you think where hardware starts, maybe to Lindsay's point a

Unknown:

little bit, hardware starts to become offered as sort of like

Unknown:

feature as a service in the gaming space. In other words,

Unknown:

you buy a gaming headset, but if you want the 3d Spatial Sound,

Unknown:

it's an extra dollar that you need to pay, right? If you want

Unknown:

the, you know, the plugin that can does noise cancelling,

Unknown:

that's an extra dollar. If you buy a razor camera, you know, to

Unknown:

do filtering, it's an extra dollar, like where we start to

Unknown:

get microtransactions like we have in games, but with

Unknown:

hardware. Does anyone see this potential future? I think you

Unknown:

always will have hardware upsells, where I thought I think

Unknown:

your point was actually an awesome one. And I followed you

Unknown:

all the way up into the part about the hardware piece I

Unknown:

actually thought you were gonna go was that they would use this

Unknown:

network to make it such that all these games that are free to

Unknown:

play can basically charge per minute, where it's like, Oh, you

Unknown:

want to play Apex legends for 20 minutes, you pay like $3 you

Unknown:

want to play it for three hours, you know, you pay $8, whatever.

Unknown:

I don't know, math just work. But point is your pay per

Unknown:

consumption.

Unknown:

It could be it's interesting, I liked I liked the idea. I've

Unknown:

always liked razors, sort of strategy around differentiating

Unknown:

themselves and, and also moving away from hardware and trying to

Unknown:

do more in services and infrastructure. So it'll be

Unknown:

curious to see how they implement this and how they

Unknown:

bring this to everything else they're doing. I am curious to

Unknown:

see, Matt, let me just read this Matt says Why get involved in

Unknown:

crypto now though, not the best time for that industry map.

Unknown:

That's totally wrong. This is the absolute best time to get

Unknown:

involved. I posted something about this today when others are

Unknown:

fearful. This is when you should be greedy.

Unknown:

Crypto is not going anywhere. Now's the best time to be buying

Unknown:

in because prices are back to normal and back to Earth and

Unknown:

very reasonable. And making investments now are where people

Unknown:

are going to win big not not buying at the maximum hype. Now

Unknown:

is when people should be investing. So I don't I totally

Unknown:

disagree with this interesting thought. But I totally disagree

Unknown:

with it.

Unknown:

Alright, guys, I want to get to our last last story here. And I

Unknown:

have to do this because you know, we are the most famous

Unknown:

gaming chair reviewers on the internet.

Unknown:

The most well respected obviously. And here we've got a

Unknown:

chair, I promise you this one is totally different and worth

Unknown:

discussing. This is

Unknown:

a Kickstarter, and it's the headline here is Oculus quest to

Unknown:

gaming chair features a big deep head for your feet. So there's

Unknown:

an Oculus quest compatible gaming chair over on

Unknown:

Kickstarter, and it lets you kick back and run around in VR

Unknown:

games using your feet. So what they're saying is moving around

Unknown:

in VR is obviously a problem. It can be an immersion breaking

Unknown:

because you can't really move around that much. But this chair

Unknown:

promises to boost immersion and boost immersion. It'll achieve

Unknown:

this by adding locomotive control

Unknown:

Also the chairs base, like a big D pad for your feet. So spinning

Unknown:

on the seat acts as an in game 360 degree movement. So you

Unknown:

won't need to deal with any weird tank controls, etc.

Unknown:

It will reduce most motion sickness etc. So let me just for

Unknown:

those of you who are watching, if you're listening to this

Unknown:

after the fact, unfortunately, you can't see, but I'll play the

Unknown:

little video here. So you can see what this thing actually

Unknown:

looks like

Unknown:

to use. I'll fast forward here, but you can see the way they

Unknown:

they use the deep head and feet controls to both move around,

Unknown:

look around and move forward by pressing on this sort of deep

Unknown:

head on their feet. I'm curious what you guys think of this,

Unknown:

because mobility is one of the big

Unknown:

you know, unresolved technologies, if you want to

Unknown:

call it that with VR and anything metaverse.

Unknown:

You love this gaming chair? Do Are we all buyers on this one?

Unknown:

Laughing at Chris's comment.

Unknown:

No, I

Unknown:

have incorporated feet. I mean, the feet are the last bastion of

Unknown:

gaming. There's not many games that incorporate your feet. So I

Unknown:

think, you know, they could play it. I mean game of DDR with us.

Unknown:

Yeah, I really liked this, but for a different reason. And I

Unknown:

actually was thinking along the lines of what Chris said as in,

Unknown:

as we get more better and better mobility experiences, I actually

Unknown:

think it'll really help in development of

Unknown:

game accessibility for a lot more people and accessibility in

Unknown:

general in the world. I think that there's a lot of potential

Unknown:

here to actually improve wheelchair mechanics if,

Unknown:

if game developers start building products like this,

Unknown:

which I think is a really cool and unintended crossover. So I

Unknown:

like that this is this is being worked on for several reasons.

Unknown:

I mean, you have to have a feeling in your feet for to use

Unknown:

this right, because of the D pad there. So I don't know if

Unknown:

there's, I mean, I guess there's some crossover, but I just think

Unknown:

this is really lazy the way I'm looking at. It's like they have

Unknown:

existing VR Tech where you can go on like those omni

Unknown:

directional treadmills and things. And someone was like,

Unknown:

Nah, I just want to sit, you know.

Unknown:

That was my take. Again, I think we're all right. And we're all

Unknown:

wrong here. But But I just think this is lazy. And I would get

Unknown:

kind of dizzy spinning around in a chair and all these

Unknown:

directions. But I'm also not.

Unknown:

I think the tech is really cool. I think it's really cool for

Unknown:

video games to have this type of experience. But I it's not what

Unknown:

I grew up on, and it's probably nothing that I'll adopt anytime

Unknown:

soon.

Unknown:

I mean, yeah, I was sort of, I'm with you on this one in the

Unknown:

sense that the article talks about solving the immersion

Unknown:

issue, which there Right, right, the problem statement is

Unknown:

correct. VR has a bit of an immersion issue when it comes to

Unknown:

mobility. Because mostly, in most games to move, you just

Unknown:

sort of teleport, right, you don't actually move your feet

Unknown:

and walk or run from location to location. And that can break the

Unknown:

immersion. But your point is spot on. This doesn't really

Unknown:

solve that, right? Because we don't walk by just sort of

Unknown:

pressing forward on our toes. I mean, that's, like, doesn't.

Unknown:

That's not That's not how I move. I don't know if that's how

Unknown:

you guys move, but

Unknown:

it doesn't really solve the immersion issue. So I'm not, I'm

Unknown:

not 100% sure on this one. Matt says yes, it's back referring to

Unknown:

the gaming chair. That is

Unknown:

Eric says gamer stops. Eric, I'm not sure what you're referring

Unknown:

to.

Unknown:

You'll have to let us know. Chris is taking investment

Unknown:

capital for wheelchair simulator in the metaverse. I mean, it

Unknown:

does feel a little bit like that. But it definitely doesn't

Unknown:

solve the immersion issue. It's cool. I just um, it's one of the

Unknown:

rare ones where I don't think I'm a buyer on this.

Unknown:

Chris says DDR equals dead stands for Kleiner.

Unknown:

That's a good one.

Unknown:

Spinning more than like, I liked the rotational abilities more

Unknown:

than the foot abilities. I think that's more of the key

Unknown:

technology here. Like the the foot thing. You're right. Like I

Unknown:

don't, I couldn't see myself playing a game where I had to

Unknown:

run and like sitting down that doesn't make any sense. But I

Unknown:

think that playing a game where you can sit down and see all

Unknown:

around you is pretty cool. It's funny you say that because I

Unknown:

thought when I first read the headline that this is where this

Unknown:

before I even saw the image that that's what this meant. In other

Unknown:

words, like imagine yourself sitting in a chair and you could

Unknown:

kind of

Unknown:

slike run with your feet in place. You know what I mean?

Unknown:

She's weird, which is like, like brushing up against sort of the

Unknown:

D pads. And I thought that's what it was

Unknown:

ran

Unknown:

it's not my favorite thing to do. No,

Unknown:

I'm Iran's it's called.

Unknown:

But I see that I don't think this is gonna work.

Unknown:

Unfortunately, I wanted it to be great. And it doesn't seem like

Unknown:

it really fixes any of the real problems.

Unknown:

Guys, that brings us to the end of this show. I will say. Please

Unknown:

give us feedback on the time. Thank you to everyone who showed

Unknown:

up at this new time. It seems like almost unanimously,

Unknown:

everyone likes the new time. We'll try and keep the show also

Unknown:

closer to an hour, I think so that people can sort of make it

Unknown:

a webinar, sort of like a weekly webinar that you do as part of

Unknown:

your workday. If you're on the East coast or the west coast.

Unknown:

You need before I get let me read Danny's comment says that

Unknown:

they develop that chair because people don't want to stand up.

Unknown:

While using Oculus. That seems what the chairs for that Oculus

Unknown:

did the app was just too much effort.

Unknown:

But as I was saying, Guys, feedback on the time, again,

Unknown:

everyone really appreciated it. Really appreciate it. If you

Unknown:

give us your feedback on the time. We're going to continue

Unknown:

this I think one more week, keep testing it out. See if you guys

Unknown:

like it. Unless there's major backlash or people tell us they

Unknown:

really don't like it. I think we're going to keep it at this

Unknown:

time. Definitely going to look into having the guests come on

Unknown:

after because the new times a bit earlier and maybe more

Unknown:

manageable for guests. So do it as a real after show. I think

Unknown:

that'll be fun.

Unknown:

And just want to thank everyone for coming again next week. It

Unknown:

will be at the same time. 2:30pm Eastern time. 11:30am Pacific

Unknown:

time. Definitely stay tuned for the podcast with Knut this week,

Unknown:

really great episode is going to come out this week. And

Unknown:

make sure to follow business of esports everywhere on Instagram

Unknown:

on tick tock on LinkedIn on YouTube on Twitch everywhere you

Unknown:

can get our content. We put a bunch of content out during the

Unknown:

week. And we hope you guys love it. Make sure also subscribe to

Unknown:

met a woman and men of business sorry for all the reminders but

Unknown:

gotta plug the shows. There's great content coming out of

Unknown:

Lindsay and Jeff every single week as well. Guys, don't forget

Unknown:

the most most important thing. The future is fun. We will see

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